Question DuPont Cyrel DPL

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Question DuPont Cyrel DPL

Postby pressroomfixer » Wed Nov 10, 2010 5:47 pm

Question DuPont Cyrel DPL
We are using DPL material with water base ink systems. The plate supplier said that we are using the wrong product to clean the plates. We are using 409 sprayed on and we use a plate brush to clean then they are rinsed under water and dried.
So what should we be using to clean water base ink off the plates? :?
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Re: Question DuPont Cyrel DPL

Postby webchem » Thu Dec 02, 2010 5:14 pm

Generally speaking, you want to use the mildest cleaner and cleaning technique that is sufficient to clean your plates thoroughly and efficiently. My concern with Formula 409 is that it may be harsher than is needed. You may be able to do as well with a milder detergent solution, which is less likely to damage the plates. If you like using an easily available commercial product because of the convenience, try Windex. It cleans water-based ink off plates well because it has the right pH, but it lacks some of the harsher cleaners in Formula 409.

Here are a couple articles that discuss plate cleaning, both the solutions used and the proper procedures.

http://www.flexography.org/flexo/article.cfm?ArticleID=400

http://www.macdermid.com/printing/pdf/Tech_Tip_12.pdf
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Re: Question DuPont Cyrel DPL

Postby justflexo » Thu Feb 03, 2011 10:28 am

Have you checked with your local Cyrel* rep? Alternatively, you may find yourself a handy quickguide using any seach engine by typing 'cyrel plate cleaning guide.pdf'. Most WB printers I've come across are using detergent to clean the plate, just make sure the plates are totally free of detergent as well as completely dry before storing.

As for brushes, I would use a horsehair type as the nylon type may not be friendly to the highlight dots on any digital plate, hth.
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Re: Question DuPont Cyrel DPL

Postby exflexo » Sun Feb 06, 2011 1:28 am

Dawn Dishwashing Soap and a Horse Hair Brush... that is ALL you need to clean plates that were used with water-based inks. If you use anything else, you will either ruin the plates or waste your valuable time.
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Re: Question DuPont Cyrel DPL

Postby Flexo Grunt » Fri Feb 11, 2011 9:21 am

This is an interesting post because recently we have been having a debate about plate cleaning. We print water base and some UV using cyrel.
Currently the pressman due to time constraints remove the cylinders with the plates and sometimes they can sit for up to a week before getting clean. The plate mounter soaks them in water, sometimes overnight, then they are cleaned with laundry detergent and a brush. Sometimes they add ammonia, and for really tough ink, they use ethyl acetate. I have my own thoughts to this process, but I am wondering what other do, thoughts of this process, or suggest better ways of handling this.
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Re: Question DuPont Cyrel DPL

Postby inkman » Wed Feb 23, 2011 11:05 am

The ingredients in Formula 409 vary depending on the whose MSDS you read, but all list similar ingredients: glycol ethers (aka cellosolve, carbitol) and some type of alkaline material like amine or caustic. I suspect there are surfactants (aka soaps) in 409 that give it its detergency. Windex is formulated similarly, without additional surfactants, but also contains a small amount of alcohol.

None of the ingredients listed in either product are that aggressive to most plate materials, especially in lower concentrations. I have never seen an un-cross-linked water-based ink that will resist either product, however, the 409 is the more aggressive cleaner of the two and probably contains higher concentrations of aggressive chemicals.

Many ink companies sell concentrated cleaners or can recommend effective cleaners for their products, and most contain chemicals similar to the ones listed above for cleaning water-based ink.
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Re: Question DuPont Cyrel DPL

Postby Robert S » Thu May 19, 2011 9:42 am

We had similar experiences. I assume that the plate people are saying that you're damaging the plates because of the way you're cleaning them or your highlight dots are being affected. We tried just about every cleaning method available and we just couldn't get the life from the plates we wanted. We cleaned EXL plates for years on press, like we all do, by scrubbing them with a lint free towel while on the cylinder. When we changed to FAST we found that the plates were much less resistant to our cleaning methods. When on press we used a tacky roller for cleaning, before storage we used a soft brush and one of the cleaners recommended by Pitman.
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Re: Question DuPont Cyrel DPL

Postby exflexo » Thu May 26, 2011 12:32 am

Pitmans cleaner is similar to Dawn Dishwashing detergent. My former Pitman rep filled me in on this fact. The horse hair brush, also sold by Pitman... has been discussed above.
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